Monday, November 03, 2008

It's deja vu, and not in a good way

My fellow Taiwanese brothers and sisters, what is happening to this country? Taiwan is a free and democratic country is it not? Taiwan is a country that respects the right to freedom of speech, right? Then why did when I just turn on the TV feel like I was looking at a country under martial law. Taiwan already went through the world's longest period of martial law (41 years) during the White Terror (
白色恐怖), it definitely does not need another one.

Today, I sadly watched Taiwanese police officers harassing and silencing with extreme force all Taiwanese citizens that tried to exercise their right to protest and free speech. Any R.O.C. flags or Tibetan flags that were displayed were immediately torn away from the bearers. Many of today's innocent protestors were quickly forced into the backseat of waiting police cars. All this to protect Chen Yun Lin (陳雲林), the Association for Relations Across the Taiwan Strait (ARATS) Chairman, as he arrived today in Taipei to perpetuate the myth that relations between Taiwan and China are actually warming. Chen Yun Lin (陳雲林) represents China, the only country in the world that is openly hostile towards Taiwan.

How does Ma Ying Jeou ( 馬英九) and his government deal with a person like this? By deploying 10,000 Taiwanese police just to protect Chen Yun Lin's eyes and ears from seeing and hearing the voice of the Taiwanese people. By the way, the entire police force in Taiwan numbers 70,000 to put the 10,000 into perspective. If Ma Ying Jeou is so worried that Chen Yun Lin might see the R.O.C. flag or hear someone say that Taiwan is independent and not a part of China, then he should just give Chen Yun Lin a blindfold and some ear plugs. Problem solved, and just think of all the money Taiwan could save.

All jokes aside, Taiwanese people really need to take a serious look at the direction this country is headed in. Today it's barbwire fences and police harassment. What's next, jail, torture and murder? Today, by attempting to exercise the democratic rights we cherish in Taiwan, we got a taste of how things are done in China when they are faced with the truth or opposition. They use brute force, media propaganda, and brute force. Do we really want closer relations with a country like this? How exactly can a free and democratic society as Taiwan's fit into Communist China? After all the blood that Taiwanese have had to spill and all the innocent people that spent years upon years in jail so that we can vote freely, are we as Taiwanese willing to give that up?

Even with the extreme police presence, the Taiwanese people will not be intimidated or silenced. Today, I watched brave soul after brave soul stand up against all odds to exercise their rights as free citizens of this great country. I saw girls and boys, students and teachers, mothers and fathers, grandmothers and grandfathers have the courage to stand and speak for us all. To those Taiwanese, I hold one fist in the air.







139 Comments:

At 12:35 AM , Anonymous veronicaNCKU said...

Dear Eric
I feel very sad when I saw all the events on tv today.
I cannot help to ask myself
"what do I work and fight for?
Taiwan?? or Mainland china??"

 
At 3:32 AM , Blogger tasha said...

thanks for the sharing! i worry for Taiwan's future. It's like old KMT days all over again. After so many years of fighting for democracy and Ma is moving backwards... why did people vote for him the first place?! I live overseas so couldn't make it back to vote... what a terrible mistake.

 
At 4:01 AM , Anonymous Anonymous said...

Taiwanese government was forced to tighten up the security by DPP politicians, because of the violence that just happened to Mr. Zhang two weeks ago. Go blame DPP for the waste of police resources. DPP politicians threatened to use violence, so why shouldn't our government proceed with caution. Stop making the security measure out like it's anything more than what it is- just extra security. Unless anyone can not move around Taiwan freely, stop demonizes KMT and Taiwan's current administration.

I thought this ad taken out by the Taiwanese aborigine congresswoman is great and totally makes fun of the hypocrisy of the "taidu 台獨" folks in Taiwan. You 台獨 ABT are too brainwashed by 台灣惡質的政客. Only the Aborigines are the true "Taiwanese".

高金素梅登廣告 「熱烈歡迎陳雲林!」  

大陸海協會長陳雲林3日中午搭乘專機抵達桃園國際機場,海基會副董事長兼秘書長高孔廉率團親自接機。而立委高金素梅等人以「台灣真正的主人」在報紙上刊登半版「熱烈歡迎陳雲林!」的廣告,表達對陳雲林的歡迎之意。

以高金素梅領銜的原住民代表,在廣告上開頭就說,「最近,台灣彷彿變成一個暴力之島、粗鄙之地,電視台每天都上演著用肢體暴力、語言暴力抗拒陳雲林先生來訪的新聞畫面。」接著又寫,「民進黨立委說,『對敵人不需要客氣』。」

廣告表示,「那怎麼不想想,大陸政府和老百姓也不喜歡民進黨,可是當民進黨人到大陸訪問時,人家不也是熱情的招待你們、讓你們免費吃住、旅遊!陳水扁、呂秀蓮、謝長廷,還有許許多多民進黨的立委、議員、商人,你們都有去過大陸,人家再怎麼不贊同你,也沒有辱罵你們、把你們推倒、更沒有威脅要把你們『當敵人抓起來…』」。

廣告寫到,「當然,這些都是因為台灣惡質的選舉文化所導致,在政客有心的操弄下,刻意製造肢體衝突,鼓動莫須有的『族群意識』、『恐共情結』,把原本應該是高高興興歡迎貴客來訪的事,扭曲成爭議的事。」

後來又說,「真是怪了,400年前,當你們閩南的漢人,大量移民來台灣這個島時,我們原住民也不是很喜歡你們,你們的開發擾弄了我們的生活,可是我們卻包容了你們400年,讓你們在我們的土地上生養、繁衍。今天,只不過一個和你們都一樣的漢人張銘清先生、陳雲林先生,從大陸來台灣訪問,一些號稱本土、愛台灣的政客因為自己的政治利益,就對來客無禮、用歇斯底里的語言隔空叫囂。真是讓人不齒!我們原住民是絕對不會這樣對待客人的。」

最後一段寫,「今天,陳雲林先生率領海協會代表團以及大陸十大銀行行長一行60人,終於到訪台灣。我們台灣原住民,也就是台灣真正的主人,樂見所有有利於台灣未來發展的事。我們台灣原住民,不僅歡迎陳雲林先生到台灣來走走看看,感受原住民的熱情和友善,更期盼陳雲林先生的到訪,能給台灣帶來一些實質的幫助。」最後以「陳雲林先生,台灣真正的主人歡迎你!」的大字結束。

連署名單:

泰雅族 高金素梅(立法委員)

    雲天寶(行政院原住民委員會族群代表)

    江朝西(尖石鄉民代表會主席)

    葉賢民(五峰鄉民代表會主席)

    鄭啟信(南澳鄉民代表會主席)

    高榮盛(苗栗縣議員)

    楊苔英(復興鄉羅浮社區發展協會理事長)


排灣族 莫那能(原住民族部落工作隊召集人)

    高瑞森(瑪家鄉民代表會主席)

    蕭惠美(屏東筏灣社區發展協會理事長)

    周陳文彬(春日青壯會理事長)



布農族 金淑敏(卓溪鄉民代表會主席)

    杜水秋(台灣原住民多族群文化交流協會理事長)

    史亞山(祖靈之邦勞動合作社理事主席)



卑南族 陳明仁(卡地布發展協會理事長)

    陳政宗(卡地布青年會會長)



太魯閣族 黃輝寶(花蓮縣議員)

鄒族   汪光力(新美社區理事會理事)

賽德克族 林健雄(仁愛鄉廬山教會長老)

噶瑪蘭族 潘朝成(花蓮噶瑪蘭族發展協會理事長)

魯凱族  麥玲鳳(霧台鄉婦女會)

達悟族  呂俠(蘭嶼在台協會會長)

 
At 5:04 AM , Anonymous Anonymous said...

"i said i call myself taiwanese. to be taiwanese today includes aboriginals, holko, hakka, and post 1947 chinese."

I am very glad you make the above statement, because that is certainly not the stance of DPP for the past 10 years. Does that mean you that you admit that President Ma is also Taiwanese contrary that what DPP has been saying?

"why should we blame the DPP for wasting of resources? they're not in power."
The quote below says it all snd explains why DPP is the one to be blamed. If a private visit by 張銘清 had became a tool of political show by the likes of Wang, why should the government not plan for the worst when 陳雲林 vistis?
最近,台灣彷彿變成一個暴力之島、粗鄙之地,電視台每天都上演著用肢體暴力、語言暴力抗拒陳雲林先生來訪的新聞畫面。」接著又寫,「民進黨立委說,『對敵人不需要客氣』。」

Even though Chinese government doesn't like the political view of DPP, have you seen that DPP politicians been treated other than courtesy when they visited China? Taidu people are total hypocrites: eager to make money from China on one hand, yet never miss any chance to stir up trouble inside Taiwan and to score political gains for themselves when KMT works to bring about a peaceful negotiation.
廣告表示,「那怎麼不想想,大陸政府和老百姓也不喜歡民進黨,可是當民進黨人到大陸訪問時,人家不也是熱情的招待你們、讓你們免費吃住、旅遊!陳水扁、呂秀蓮、謝長廷,還有許許多多民進黨的立委、議員、商人,你們都有去過大陸,人家再怎麼不贊同你,也沒有辱罵你們、把你們推倒、更沒有威脅要把你們『當敵人抓起來…』」。

 
At 5:07 AM , Blogger Eric said...

aboriginals are definitely the first taiwanese to inhabit taiwan. have i ever said otherwise? just like native americans were the first americans to inhabit america. i understand this. i never said anywhere that i am a true taiwanese. i said i call myself taiwanese. to be taiwanese today includes aboriginals, holko, hakka, and post 1947 chinese.

why should we blame the DPP for wasting of resources? they're not in power. the KMT is the one that's in control of the police. or do you not see the connection? i object to the way the police abused taiwanese citizens and denied their rights to free speech. the same rights to free speech you used to write on this blog. think about it.

and just to clarify, you're calling me brainwashed right? because you back up your argument with a piece of KMT propaganda, which you even admitted was paid for by a congresswoman as proof to why i'm wrong. do you not see the irony in that? propaganda is used for brainwashing.

thanks for your post.

 
At 5:12 AM , Blogger Eric said...

Ma Ying Jeou calls himself Chinese. And he has said it publicly time and time again. Just because he calls himself Taiwanese and speaks a little Taiwanese before the election doesn't make him Taiwanese. Don't be so easily fooled.

 
At 5:22 AM , Blogger Eric said...

And also, DPP politicians aren't met with large protests in China first and foremost because Taiwan doesn't have 1800+ ballistics missiles aimed at China. We also don't have an Anti-secession law giving ourselves the legal right to attack China.

You think that just the DPP want to make money in China? Exactly why do you think the KMT is opening up everything to China for? MONEY, MONEY, MONEY! The KMT is lining their pockets as we speak. they have control of all the entire government and you're still pointing fingers at the DPP. the sooner you realize that the DPP isn't the problem, the sooner you will be on your way to the truth.

 
At 5:31 AM , Anonymous Anonymous said...

"You think that just the DPP want to make money in China? Exactly why do you think the KMT is opening up everything to China for? MONEY, MONEY, MONEY!"

Is KMT hiding the fact that they want to make MONEY, MONEY, MONEY? They are not hiding that fact. In contrast, DPP politcians are just hypocrites.

 
At 5:41 AM , Anonymous Anonymous said...

"Ma Ying Jeou calls himself Chinese. And he has said it publicly time and time again. Just because he calls himself Taiwanese and speaks a little Taiwanese before the election doesn't make him Taiwanese. Don't be so easily fooled."

See how brainwashed you are. Ma Ying Jeou had said it over and over and over that he IS Chinese AND Taiwanese. He grew up in Taiwan, moved back to Taiwan to serve Taiwanese after getting his degree in the U.S., not unlike what you are doing. Ma's father is buried in Taiwan and he himself planned to die and be buried in Taiwan himself. Of couse, no matter whe he says or do, you will not count him as Taiwanese. Only DPP gets to decide who is Taiwanese. By DPP standard, you have excluded yourself as Taiwanese. Unless you would take Ma's words that he is Taiwanese, you should not be Taiwanese either by your own and DPP's standard.

As a matter of fact, Ma is the ONLY politician at this level of power who has not even visited China mainland. He has only visited HK. Even ex President Chen had vistied Beijing in 1992, but of course only DPP politicians can visit Beijing and Shainghai and still be Taiwanese, but not Ma. DPP are just Hypocrites.

 
At 6:43 AM , Anonymous Get a Jobby Job said...

Eric,
Get a real job! I bet you're one of the kids graduated from bio but can't get in med school. Stop living off your parents in Taiwan. The burgers not gonna flip by themselves here in the States. You've made your point in Taiwan now come serve me fries and milkshake here in the States.

 
At 8:30 AM , Anonymous Jester Master said...

To get a jobby job,
I disagree! Eric's talent shouldn't be used in serving fries and shakes. He pretty good at making an ass out of himself and telling jokes on this blog. My little cousin's birthday is just in the corner, I need a clown..
Eric, Why don't you come here make my cousin some balloons? I'll pay you cash.

 
At 8:34 AM , Blogger Eric said...

by not believing what ma ying jeou says does not make me brainwashed in anyway. a lot of different things have come out of mr. ma's mouth, with very little of it being true. i mean, look at every campaign promise he's made, he's already broken them and it hasn't even been a year yet. what happened to the economy that was magically supposed to turn around? what about jobs? unemployment? inflation? foreign investment?

who cares if his father is buried here? his father ran away to HK to have Ma born there because he was scared that the Chinese were going to attack so he fled Taiwan like a coward. That's why Ma was born in HK. They only came back after they knew it was safe. Chiang Kai Shek (the murderous dictator) and his little one are buried in Taiwan. Are they Taiwanese? Hell No!

So let me get this straight, you know that the KMT is just in it for the money and you respect them for this. they're selling you out and you respect them for this? fabulous.

Hello, Hong Kong is actually in China, or were you not aware of that? That's like saying in didn't go to the US, I just went to LA. Huh?? And since Ma Ying Jeou is systematically selling out Taiwan in hopes he can reunify, why does he need to go to China? He's turning us into China.

 
At 8:39 AM , Anonymous jester master said...

Ummmm.... My dear clown...You do know the economy down turn is on the global scale, right? My offer's still good. Come down to Oklahoma and make my cousin some balloons. I'll pay you cash.

 
At 8:47 AM , Blogger Eric said...

jobby job and jester, thanks for taking the time to leave two of the greatest and most well thought out arguments i've ever had the experience and honor of reading. you two have really made one hell of a difference. if i could only be as erudite as the two of you. haha, next.

 
At 8:51 AM , Blogger Eric said...

I actually had no idea that we were in a world financial meltdown. Could you take a second to explain to me this whole globalization thing while your at it? actually, could you start at just what the economy is?

 
At 8:55 AM , Anonymous jester master said...

Do you have a job? Do you live with your parents? I'm pretty serious about my offer. If you don't take it someone else like you with low education from south of Taiwan will take it. and get my name right. It's jester master.

 
At 9:00 AM , Blogger Eric said...

jester molester, yes i do, no i don't. and i really don't care how serious you are.

 
At 9:02 AM , Anonymous Anonymous said...

hahaha... listen to yourself. Getting all pissed off when people question your claim as Taiwanese, yet you don't hesitate to question others' Taiwanese-ness. Sounds like your bottom line is that only YOU and DPP can decide what is good and what is right for Taiwan. Only YOU and DPP can determine who passes as Taiwanese or not.

Interesting how you claim to be a Democrat and a supporter of Obama. Sarah Palin has been calling Obama Socialist and implying that he is a communist for his tax policy. She practically accuses him of colluding with Iran and the terrorists by pursuing a different diplomatic strategy. Many ignorant Republicans still believe that Obama is a Mulsim today... hahaha.. Palin and her supporters even openly question Obama's "American-ness". Listen to yourself and listen to DPP. How are you different from the likes of Sarah Palin.

Didn’t you just accuse another Taiwanese of worrying about an "imaginary war" breaking out between China and Taiwan if Taiwan doesn't go about TI goal carefully? Yet, you keep pointing out the 1800+ ballistics missiles aiming at Taiwan direction. Are those missles real in your eyes or not? Are you serious when you accuse other Taiwanese of worrying about a war if we do declare independence too soon? Is a smart and deliberate negotiation with China to avoid a war better for Taiwan or not?

 
At 9:07 AM , Anonymous jester master said...

Sure let me enlighten you just a little bit! The meltdown started with irresponsible lending in the U.S. due to the hyper growth in housing sector. The banks (Investment Banks) repackaged the subprime loans into what's called CDOs (Collateralized Debt Obligations) and offer them to the institutional investors (Hedge funds, pensions) The institutions also leveraged their risk by purchasing credit default swaps(insurance against default) When the howe owners fall behind their payments, CDO started to default, and as a result, the hedge counterparties(Lehman, AIG and such) of the CDS contracts have to pay out huge amount of insurance. As the many toxic debt still unknown, banks across the world started to hoard cash and stopped lending money.(e.x Increase in LIBOR) Many international business without debt financing started to decline. As a result, global economy faced dramatic slow down.

 
At 9:13 AM , Anonymous jester master said...

Listen to me clown! I'm not finished yet. As for the inflation...traders who saw the slow down in the equity sector started to hedge the downside risk by buying futures in oil, gas and other commodities. In addition, due to decrease in Fed funds rate, U.S. exchange rate decreased dramatically, which further fueled the increase in oil prices.

 
At 9:14 AM , Blogger Eric said...

i don't claim to be a supporter for obama, i am. i voted for him. and how am i like palin? i can't see russia from my house.

i don't have to have a missile in my eye to know that it's pointed this way. that's the whole point of missiles. it's the whole long range thing. and if you're saying that i should not worry about something just because i can't see it, well i don't even know where to begin with that.

 
At 9:18 AM , Anonymous jester master said...

Cleaning toilet for me doesn't count as a job. According to "Min She" you still live at home in Tainan. It doesn't seem like you know how the economy works in the world. Now, go stick with your worthless bio degree and make my cousin some balloons.

 
At 9:23 AM , Blogger Eric said...

oh molester of jesters, i was being sarcastic. i know all about the financial crisis. someone with a name like yours that might want to study up on sarcasm.

 
At 9:28 AM , Anonymous jester master said...

Doesn't seem like you do with your bio degree and worthless Taiwanese diploma. I know what I'm talking about and you don't. I'm all facts and you're all opinions. You know what they say about opinions? It's like an asshole, everybody has one and it stinks. Get your facts straight next time when you open your mouth. Quote Eric: "Could you take a second to explain to me this whole globalization thing while your at it? actually, could you start at just what the economy is?" It's not sarcasm, it's called arrogance. You were so full of yourself before you know that I know my shit.

 
At 9:32 AM , Anonymous jester master said...

You know ALL about the crisis uh? Well why don't you tell me about the rating agencies' contribution in this crisis? In case you don't know what rating agencies are, here are three major ones (S&P, Moodys and Fitch.) It's your chance to enlighten me, clown. If you get it right, I might let you flip the burgers I'm gonna cook up at my cousin's party.

 
At 9:32 AM , Anonymous Anonymous said...

"i don't have to have a missile in my eye to know that it's pointed this way. that's the whole point of missiles. it's the whole long range thing. and if you're saying that i should not worry about something just because i can't see it, well i don't even know where to begin with that."

So we are saying the same thing. War could break out between Taiwan and China, because those freaking missiles are real. Most Taiwanese want independence, but some of us want to go about it differently without risking a war.

You will be just like Sarah Palin if you accuse another Taiwanese as not "Taiwanese" and accusing them of "selling" Taiwan to China when they are trying to pursue a more practical relationship with China. America is not going to help Taiwan if a war breaks out, because it will pursue its own national interest. Taiwanese should only count on ourselves and tread carefully in our TI goal, because those missiles are real and the possibility of a war should never be discounted so lightly.

Clowns like Wang who roughed up 張銘清 and threaten to "arrest" and beat up 陳雲林 are only working to advance their own political career. DPP are acting more like political clowns than a viable and responsible opposition party. Their rhetoric is still aiming at the same old DEEP green supporters.

 
At 9:41 AM , Blogger Eric said...

calling your own opinions facts does not make them facts. wow, you told me what every single article in the world has been writing about for the past year when it comes to the sub-prime mortgage crisis. you really do know your stuff.

and what's this crazy fascination you have with your cousin's birthday party? are you worried that no one is going to come? i could try to let some people know about it.

 
At 9:56 AM , Anonymous jester master said...

What about the rating agencies contribution? That's not in the article. Only people who knows great degree of economy like you and I would know. Why don't you use this as YOUR chance to shine? Point out one opinion in my previous two posts about the economy. I'm not obsessed in my cousin's party. Just I need someone to make some balloons and I value your talent in this area. You have not had a valid counter argument since my first post, but I do enjoy your jokes.

 
At 10:25 AM , Anonymous Jester master said...

"calling your own opinions facts does not make them facts. wow, you told me what every single article in the world has been writing about for the past year when it comes to the sub-prime mortgage crisis."

Uhmm... So every single article out there is all my all opinion....you need to take a debate class before you start talking. You started to sound like Sarah Palin in Katie Couric interview.

"what's this crazy fascination you have with your cousin's birthday party? are you worried that no one is going to come? i could try to let some people know about it. " You're not answering my questions directly, this time, you sound like Sarah Palin in VP debate.

 
At 10:39 AM , Anonymous jester master said...

As I'm taking my sweet time waiting for your rebuttal of my previous claims. Why don't you also tell me about the relationship between the changes in Fed funds rate and foreign exchange rate? You can find this answer straight out of your econ text book...if you have ever read one.

 
At 11:07 AM , Anonymous jester master said...

I'm still waiting, Eric...If you don't know just admit it. I can respect that. I admit that I don't know jack shit about biology and I don't go start a blog posting articles about theories in photosynthesis. I take your silence as that you learned your lesson, just don't make the same mistake again.

 
At 12:17 PM , Anonymous Anonymous said...

jester master is such an idiot! He is the one that's a clown and needs a second job for sure.. cuz it seems like he has nothing to do but leave poo poo head comments in Eric's blog.

-Sana

 
At 12:27 PM , Anonymous jester master said...

"Poo Poo head comment?" Great! Another prodigy child just like Bush, just like Eric. Why don't you talk like a grown up before I put you in time out and take your computer privilege away. I don't need a second job, I make plenty of money and I have plenty of time to burn. Unlike you jobless Taiwanese thugs here. Oh and Eric, I'm still waiting......

 
At 2:44 PM , Blogger Eric said...

oh molester, what do we really need to say about the ratings agencies? obviously all the AAA ratings they were giving out left and right weren't exactly spot on, take GE for instance.

wow, that's great that you have so much money to burn. that makes it evident to many people you couldn't possibly understand what real taiwanese people in taiwan are suffering through. since you're so rich and have nothing but time to burn (sounds lonely) maybe you should start burning your money. perhaps you could buy some friends for your little kah-tzung.

since your so down with the financial jargon, can you tell me what the traders on the floor of the Chicago Mercantile Exchange mean when they say WTF?

and i think you really said it best before when you said, "You were so full of yourself before you know that I know my shit." i think we finally can agree on one thing, you know shit.

game, set, match.

 
At 3:12 PM , Anonymous Anonymous said...

We Taiwanese people can NOT eat democracy because it brings the 20 years' social unrest, chaos, and conflicts!
We Taiwanese peole CAN eat totalitarianism or dictatorship because it brings Taiwan ECONOMIC miracle!

So,my conclusion: OVERTHROWING DEMOCRACY is our Taiwanese people's purpose and defeat ABT because they are brainwashed by USA bureaucratism!

 
At 3:31 PM , Blogger Eric said...

to the person above. huh?? how can you eat an ideology? this you're going to have to explain to me or i'm just going to write you off as another crazy person. what totalitarianism has been feeding you isn't food, it's called BS.

and are you trying to say that totalitarianism is free from social unrest, chaos and conflict? have you ever read a book, not propaganda, i mean a real history book?

every ideology brings with it pros and cons. democracy isn't perfect by any means. but if you really think that people in taiwan are waiting for another dictator to take power, you are truly delusional.

how can you have a conclusion, you don't even have an introduction. don't get too ahead of yourself here.

 
At 3:34 PM , Anonymous Anonymous said...

台灣民眾自發集會 熱烈歡迎陳雲林一行訪台



2008年11月04日



人們聚集在通往圓山飯店沿途迎候陳雲林。(背景是陳雲林下榻的圓山飯店)。

  你好台灣網11月4日消息:前一日還是艷陽高照、酷熱難當;今天(3日)一早,台北的上空則霧靄朦朧,清新涼爽,還下起了陣雨。風雨澆不息民眾的熱情,有很多台灣民眾自發地聚集在陳雲林會長沿途經過的地方,用熱烈的方式迎接他。



民眾冒雨前往歡迎陳雲林,不少是白發老人。

  當天台北有多處歡迎陳雲林的集會,其中,在新生北路公園集會的人群最多,他們拉著“歡迎陳會長抵台 促進兩岸和平”、“兩岸和平 人民盼望社會繁榮”等橫幅,在陳雲林會長經過的的時候,高喊“歡迎陳會長”、“兩岸和平”,對陳雲林來台進行兩會協商表示支持。

  冒著菲菲細雨,人群中不乏頭發斑白的老人,他們穿著雨衣,打著雨傘,熱情地向陳雲林的車隊表達歡迎之意。

  “陳會長來到台灣,兩岸進行協商,是我們期盼已久的大事,我們非常高興。”

  集會召集人謝遠智說,“我們都是熱愛和平的人,自發在聚集在一起歡迎陳會長,就是因為他來台灣協商,能給兩岸帶來和平。”

  據謝遠智說,歡迎的人群來自台灣各地,僅從他的家鄉台中來的民眾就有800多人,他們乘坐大巴來到台北。



高雄蕭先生:老百姓很需要的就是安定、和平、繁榮。

  另一位來自高雄的蕭家振先生說,高雄也有很多人到台北來歡迎陳雲林會長,“即使今天沒有來的人,心裡對陳會來台灣也是支持的。”他說,大部分民眾都歡迎、支持“江陳會”,因為老百姓很需要的就是安定、和平、繁榮。




陳雲林下榻的飯店,有很多團體給陳雲林送來果籃。

  在人群中,有一位台商韓先生,他是從大陸專程回台灣來,就是為了對陳江會談表示支持。“陳會長能到台北來,是一件大好事,他是帶著大禮物來的,對台灣是一件好事,對大陸也是一件好事,我們支持他來。”韓先生說,現在國際金融動蕩,世界經濟不景氣,只有大陸經濟最穩定。相信台灣絕大多數人是支持的,只有少數人出來抗議。“台灣是開放的社會,每個人都表達意願的自由,但必須和平理性,絕不能有暴力的事情。”韓先生說,陳會長來台灣,台股大漲,這是很久看不到的現像,說明大家是歡迎他的。



途遇另一組歡迎人群。

  走出公園,在另一條街上,另一隊歡迎的人群舉著鮮明的旗子等候陳雲林經過,表示對陳江會談的支持。

來源:你好台灣網

 
At 3:37 PM , Blogger Eric said...

and one more thing, exactly what voice will the taiwanese people have under a dictatorship? i mean, you just said, "OVERTHROWING DEMOCRACY is our Taiwanese people's purpose..." under a dictatorship, the people don't make any choices. were you aware of that?

 
At 3:38 PM , Anonymous Ross said...

To Jester molester:

I believe you don't need Eric to be your cousin's clown.. listen to yourself.. you are doing such a fantastic job to be a jerk in Eric's blog. So, i believe you will do a good job for your cousin's b'day.. (u can be the clown and the chef!..isn't that wonderful?)
p.s. do you live in Taiwan? or US? This blog talks about Taiwan and its people, not for you to talk rubbish..

 
At 3:43 PM , Anonymous Anonymous said...

"i said i call myself taiwanese. to be taiwanese today includes aboriginals, holko, hakka, and post 1947 chinese."


If you said so, then the members of "Taiwan Democratic Self-Government League"(台灣民主自治同盟) should be allowed to return back to Taiwan and vote for their dearest CCP!


台灣二二八事件後,一部分台灣民運人士逃往中國大陸、香港。其中統獨立場皆有,台灣民主自治同盟即屬於支持統一者。

台灣民主自治同盟1947年11月12日(孫中山誕辰紀念日)由謝雪紅等人在香港成立,但當時偽稱在臺北,以躲避中華民國政府國安人員的耳目。1948年台盟宣布擁護中國共產黨領導的「新民主主義革命」,成員陸續加入中國共產黨。同年5、6月間成立「香港支部」——事實為是總部的偽裝,其主要是為了轉移國安人員注意力的障眼法。

。後中華民國政府旗下的國家安全機關正式將該組織列為中共外圍組織之一。7月20日宣布成立總部領導機構,由謝雪紅擔任主席。



I'm also the secret member of Kaohsiung Wenzaorian Student Association of Taiwan Democratic Self-Government League(台灣民主自治同盟高雄文藻外語學院學生秘密分會)and we will vote for our dearest CCP.

Yes, I'm Hoklo of Taiwan, but my political view should be different and you Eric should not blame us for anything under your so-called rule of democracy,otherwise you are FAKE democrat!

 
At 3:47 PM , Anonymous Anonymous said...

The Taiwan Democratic Self-Government League (TDSGL)

Comprising Taiwan natives , the TDSGL was founded on November 12, 1947 by a number of public figures from Taiwan Province. In 1948 it declared support for the New Democratic Revolution led by the CPC.
In September 1949 it attended the First Plenary Session of the CPPCC in Beijing, participating in drawing up the Common Program.

Since New China was founded, the TDSGL has actively taken part in socialist construction and played an important part in achieving the reunification of the motherland.

 
At 3:52 PM , Anonymous Anonymous said...

Two Taiwan-related organizations jointly published an article Sunday to commemorate Taiwan people's patriotic uprising that took place on Feb. 28, 1947, calling for unity across the Straits and the opposition of the separatist remarks distorting the movement.


   The Democratic Self-government League and the All-China Federation of Taiwan Compatriots said in the article titled "Compatriots Across the Straits Join Hands Together to Work for a Bright Future" that the Feb. 28 uprising was a patriotic feat.


   The Taiwan people courageously fought against the autocratic Kuomingtang government in order to seek democracy, while the wholeof China was encouraged by the victory in the war against Japanese aggression, the article says.


   The uprising was also an important part of a nationwide patriotic and democratic movement against the ruling Kuomingtang regime. The Communist Party showed deep interest in the movement and its underground organization even participated in the uprising,it says.


   Historic facts show that the people across the Taiwan Straits have an identical pursuit that is to fight oppression and autocracy and struggle for democracy, and they also support each other in fighting the autocratic rule and building their homeland,says the article.


   However, the current Taiwan authorities and separatist forces, in order to attain their political goal, distorted the uprising as"an independent movement of the Taiwan people to fight the regime from outside," or even as "a start of Taiwan independence," which completely ignores history.


   The article quotes an open letter of organizers of the uprisingto people of the whole country as saying that the aim of the movement is to "mop up corrupt officials and boost political reform in the province (of Taiwan). We do not reject compatriots from other provinces, but rather, we welcome them to participate in the political work of this province."


   Today, says the article, the separatist forces use the historicevent as a tool for their splittist activities, regardless of the Taiwan people's sincere hope for peace, stability and development.Their attempt to create conflicts among ethnic groups on the Taiwan island and between the two sides of the Straits is a reversal of democracy in Taiwan and a blasphemy against and humiliation of the martyrs of the movement.


   Thousands of Taiwan people were killed in the uprising.


   To commemorate the 57th anniversary of the Feb. 28 uprising with Taiwanese compatriots is to "restore the historical truth," says the article, which calls on the Taiwan society to cherish itshard-won achievements in promoting democracy and maintain ethnic harmony, social stability and economic prosperity on the island.


   It also calls for cooperation between the two sides of the Straits to jointly maintain peace and stability across the Straitsand make concerted efforts to realize the reunification and revitalization of the Chinese nation.


   The Taiwan Democratic Self-government League was founded by several Taiwan patriots in Hong Kong in December 1947 after the uprising failed.

 
At 3:59 PM , Anonymous Anonymous said...

親歷:“二.二八”絕不是“台獨”源頭

周青:原籍台灣省台北市。1947年“二.二八起義”爆發時任《中外日報》記者,曾與該報另一位記者共同報道了該事件的首篇新聞特寫。談及事件發生的背景,周青說,接管台灣的國民黨政府官員魚龍混雜,其統治腐敗使得島內民生凋敝。物價一日三跳,不少人依靠販賣私煙的薄利維生。1947年2月27日晚,一名煙警打傷女煙販后,當局不但多次轉移凶手,更鎮壓要求懲罰凶手的群眾,才引起波及全省的“二.二八事件”。因此,“二.二八事件”是一場台灣民眾不滿當局統治的自發性暴動,與“台獨”沒有關聯。他還說,通過一名舊書商人在電台廣播,爆發於台北的事端得以被全島所知,而當時的中共台灣工作委員會尚在台灣中部開會,所以“二.二八起義”背后也沒有所謂的中共籌劃。

林東海:台灣彰化縣人。“二.二八”爆發時,他是台中第一中學的學生。他說,雖然清政府將台灣割與日本,但台灣人的心始終與祖國大陸息息相連,台灣人血管裡流著中國人的血,日本人雖然統治台灣50年也無法將其換去。日本投降后,不會講普通話的台灣學生為了能與祖國大陸加強交流,停掉一些課,從漢語拼音起步,學習普通話,學唱《義勇軍進行曲》,學唱《滿江紅》和《蘇武牧羊》,回歸祖國的激動難以抑制。但是,當年國民黨接管后的腐敗統治與台灣民眾的期望想差甚大,台灣人民並未得到理想中的呵護和撫慰。“二.二八事件”中,台灣人民反抗的正是國民黨的反動統治和貪官污吏。林東海說,在當時的台中,他從未聽過什麼“台灣獨立”的口號,也從未見過“台獨”的傳單。民眾隻要求改革政治。

紀朝欽:也是“二.二八”的親歷者。他在台盟創始人之一謝雪紅的感召下經香港回到大陸。對於謝雪紅是“台獨”旗手的說法,紀朝欽十分憤慨。他激動地說,謝雪紅反帝、反“台灣獨立”的愛國信念一生堅定不移,她是“二.二八事件”的旗幟性人物。紀朝欽說,把謝雪紅說成“台獨”旗手的人是在歪曲歷史,顛倒黑白,在政治上是非常不道德的。他表示,說起“二.二八事件”,想起身邊的死難者,心情很不平靜,今天他的話都是據實而說。

黃幸:時為台大工學院機械系學生,在台北士林參加了“二.二八起義”。他說,“台獨”活動不是產生於“二.二八”之時,而是其后。

曾重郎:台灣新竹市人。1947年參加“二.二八起義”時,他擔任學生隊指揮。在起義中,他保護了新竹中學校長辛志平(外省人)。起義失敗后,他被新竹市憲兵隊傳訊扣押。曾重郎曾於“二.二八事件”40周年時將這段經歷撰寫成文,文章流傳回台灣后,引起島內媒體不小的反響。談及當年之事,曾重郎說,保護外省籍教師並非他的個人行為,當時台大的很多大陸籍教授都被保護起來了。他說,群眾能夠明辨是非,“二.二八”時群眾的直接訴求是清理貪官污吏,政治訴求是民主自治。因此歸根到底,“二.二八”是一場反暴政、反腐敗的愛國民主運動。

 
At 4:02 PM , Blogger Eric said...

yeah, you guys can definitely come to Taiwan and vote for the Chinese Communist Party candidate in any of our elections. I welcome you to come. How did the last CCP official do in our Taiwanese elections? Not too well considering their our no CCP officials. i'm glad you guys vote for communists here in Taiwan. i think you guys have a real winning strategy.

 
At 4:10 PM , Anonymous Anonymous said...

" How did the last CCP official do in our Taiwanese elections?"


How did Chen Shui-Bian do in destroying Taiwan economics?

How did pro-democrats do in make 20 years' political unrest in Taiwan?


Well, a Taiwanese female student founded a Taiwan Nazi Party which claims to abandon democracy and getting popular somewhere. do u think that it is a signal that showed u democrats disturbed we Taiwanese so much?

 
At 5:00 PM , Anonymous global resident said...

I guess the first anonymous may be a ROC official, and is paid by Taiwanese taxpayers’ money (time in his office) to read this blog and leave comments.
The jester master could be an offspring of a former or current ROC official hiding in the States (because he is afraid of 1200+ missiles from the PRC, but miscalculates the wisdom of Bin Laden). If he is so rich, it could be that his parents or grandparents ate up enough money from the people of Taiwan, that’s why he has nothing to do but to mock and curse people in Eric’s blog.
Legislator Kao-Jing Su Mei is not 100% indigenous, she has half Chinese blood, but she talks as if she has only indigenous blood and represents all tribes.
And to those Chinese or Taiwanese whose minds have nothing but money and materialism, read New Testament (NIV) 1 Timothy 6:17, James 5. How can one’s freedom and democracy be sold in exchange for work or money? Great material richness leads to spiritual poverty. Find a balance between the two, and be aware of where Ma’s economic myth will lead us to.
No money and no freedom!

 
At 5:42 PM , Anonymous ross said...

I also feel sad and furious about how all the protestors have been treated by police force in Taiwan these 2 days. Where is our right to speak up? where is demoncracy? and where is freedom? I only see 假民主 in Taiwan at this moment.

"廣告表示,「那怎麼不想想,大陸政府和老百姓也不喜歡民進黨,可是當民進黨人到大陸訪問時,人家不也是熱情的招待你們、讓你們免費吃住、旅遊!陳水扁、呂秀蓮、謝長廷,還有許許多多民進黨的立委、議員、商人,你們都有去過大陸,人家再怎麼不贊同你,也沒有辱罵你們、把你們推倒、更沒有威脅要把你們『當敵人抓起來…』」。"
This is so not true. Have 陳水扁、呂秀蓮 ever been to China as a Taiwanese president and vice-president? It's impossible. I think once they step out of plane, they would be pulled aside and 槍斃. If you still remember in Aug, 楊惠如 event, she was just an organiser in 謝長廷's election campaign. How did China treat her? They didn't allow her to go to Benjin Olympics, 原機遣返.

I worry for Taiwan's future now..

 
At 7:27 PM , Blogger Eric said...

this secret message goes out to ultra secret member 2266, i mean 8787, sorry 007, of the TDSLG. won't your fellow secret cult members be upset you have revealed yourself. i guess now you're just a member of the TDSLG. don't worry i won't tell anyone about you guys. no one really cares anyway.

in a free and democratic society you can believe in what you want and practice what you want. do you think your friend would have been able to start a nazi party in taiwan if this was a communist country? the reason she was able to start one, is because this is a democratic society. i mean, look at the name of your own group for christ sakes, Taiwan Democratic Self-Government League. do you have any idea what democratic means? or is that the secret of your little group, you don't tell anyone what TDSLC stands for.

and your right, everything is a-bian's fault. the reason that the entire world is in a global financial crisis is all because of a-bian. the reason we have melamine in our food is because of a-bian. everything that has gone wrong in the world is a-bian fault. please come up with something original.

 
At 10:36 PM , Anonymous jester master said...

Good boy, Eric. You answered my question. Now rollover and fetch me a ball. If you know so much about the economy, get a job here and pay your tax.

 
At 11:39 PM , Anonymous Anonymous said...

jester molester,
why should eric listens to a rustic clown like you.

Eric,
how are you?
ignor those thugs is the best way. obviously they are trying to make you mad. But, they didn't succed.
( what a funny name you gave this guy!! haha).

Yes, I not happy at all about recent news. I will write more about it later.

Amities,
chun

 
At 1:37 AM , Anonymous Anonymous said...

"This is so not true. Have 陳水扁、呂秀蓮 ever been to China as a Taiwanese president and vice-president? It's impossible. I think once they step out of plane, they would be pulled aside and 槍斃. If you still remember in Aug, 楊惠如 event, she was just an organiser in 謝長廷's election campaign. How did China treat her? They didn't allow her to go to Benjin Olympics, 原機遣返."

槍斃????? You obviously still live in the 70's, (but not surprising, because DPP is still engaged in the Taiwanese version of Cultural Revolution.:)
楊惠如 was stopped from entering China because before her departure, she held a press conference saying stupid things like she was prepared not to return to Taiwan... (WTF). China wanted a great Olympics and they had every right to not admit anyone into their country who was openning saying that she was going to cause trouble. Anyway, even for the U.S. custom, it is not rare for people to be 原機遣返 if the immigration and custom officer doesn't want to admit them.

So many DPP politicians have visited China and I have yet to hear anyone being roughed up like Zhang was here. As a matter of fact, when 張銘清 was being roughed up here, 陳菊 and 蘇治芬 (current Mayors of Kaohsiung and Yun-lin County) were visiting China at the same time. China didn't even try to "avenage" 張銘清's humiliation by roughing up 陳菊 or 蘇治芬. So stop justifying DPP politicians' hypocrisy.

 
At 3:46 AM , Anonymous Dr. Eye said...

ERIC,

Freddy and GUT has been looking for you for a while.
Pleas contact GUT http://taiwanguts.com/
asap. Its time to get the network tightened up.

They mess with Freddy and Eric, they mess with ALL OF US!!!

- Dr. Eye

 
At 6:31 AM , Anonymous Leo who will fuk jester master up soon said...

to all you eric haters, pro-china a$shole lickers, anti-taiwanese, mofos...just shut the hell up, pack your shit, and move to china. If you dont like it here (eric's website or taiwan), then get the fuck out! leave!

to jester dicksucking master, if you are so down, then leave your address and i'll fuken come find u..dont be a pussyass cyberbully here, it only shows what a bitch you really are. now, go back to your little cube and pretend you are important at your stupid job.

 
At 7:08 AM , Anonymous Anonymous said...

"to all you eric haters, pro-china a$shole lickers, anti-taiwanese, mofos..."

Wow...is this what we get in a "democratic" Taiwan? Your use of language doesn't prove that democracy produces "better" citizens and doesn't demonstrate why others should embrace democracy.

 
At 8:09 AM , Anonymous jester master said...

Leo,
Wow, I'm really scared. How can you find me if you can't even afford gas money? You probably can't even afford a bicycle. I'm not pro-China. I'm just pro economic and common sense. I wasn't wrong calling all you low education Taiwan southerners "thugs." You're mad because I tell the truth. You want to fight because you run out of legitimate arguments. At least I have a cube to go back to. You and Eric both don't even have a job.

 
At 8:36 AM , Blogger Stuff Mainlanders Like said...

what the KMT regime should have done was allowing peaceful protests without hindering the freedom of speech. it was a bad call made by ma and a bad day in taiwan's democracy.

with that being said, i also want to condemn the violent protests previously made which could possibly be the cause of the censorship (or the excuse ma made thereof). either way, we should show the world the peaceful side of taiwan independence instead of the violent side.

eric, i am not hating on you. you need to understand, as an half post 1947, i consider myself taiwanese and chinese. i definitely would differentiate myself from a mainlander and i am very proud of taiwan. however, due to divisive politics, a new definition of "taiwanese" came about and all of a sudden, i am no longer taiwanese. it's like how asian americans always get asked the question "where are you from" even though they might be borne in the states. many americans automatically assume you are not "american" and not "from here". that's the same feeling i get from many deep green folks. (funny because my dad is deep green and from the south)

earlier i had ask you what you would do if taiwan gets attacked. if you can absolutely say that you will stay and fight for taiwan, then i salute you. however, you can't use red herring and compare patriotism for taiwanese and american people. america is not in a fearful state of obliteration, however, if taiwan declares de jure independence, it has the potential for catastrophe.

just because you do not support de jure independence does not mean you are any less taiwanese. i want the best for taiwan, which is peace and prosperity. not ethnic division and perpetuation of hate and political partisanship. from what you've been writing, all i've seen is what i have mentioned.

there should be more issues than blue and green. people should care more about china/taiwan. i am interested in what you have to say in terms of unity for all taiwanese (that is, all inclusive, including expats).

 
At 9:05 AM , Anonymous jester master said...

I'm done here. Ross is right, I'm too smart to be here. I feel bad, this is too easy. Arguing with you ignorant people is like taking candies from kids in the special-ed class.

Leo,
I don't care how you guys do in your uncivilized southern Taiwan, but here, if you wanna fuck me up, make an appointment with my retarded secretary first. Her name is Sana, you can find her on this blog.

Anyways, Here's my address:
401 N. Wabash Ave.
Chicago, IL.
Just tell the door man your name is Leo and you're coming to fuck jester master up. He'll let you right in.

 
At 9:15 AM , Anonymous Leo who will fuk jester master up soon said...

to jester-the cock master-bater, first of all, im not eric, and this has nothing to do with him, it's your cyberbully act that gets me. and I've ran out of arguments? Just scroll up and read your stupid comments…you didn’t write anything constructive at all, except talking trash and making personal attack on eric in the first place, and for that, i think you've ran out of arguments and started acting thuggish in the first place, so as a bystander, I believe you should get f’d up for being a retard writing non-value added comments, and okay, you called me a thug, so what? where's your address I’ve asked for? too chicken to leave it, right?! Fine, leave your email address then, you coward…by the freaking way, I was born and raised in taipei just like most of you china lovers, but I don’t suck chinamen’s ding dong for living like you do. Again, you are nothing but a pathetic cyberbully whorebag…one last time, leave your address or your number, and I’ll freaking find you…you little coward. Now, go back to your tiny cube and hide behind your monitor like you do everyday, you corporate little-me employee…and don’t forget your lunch box when you log off your computer!

 
At 9:35 AM , Anonymous jester master said...

Leo,
Can you read, fob?
My address:
401 N. Wabash Ave.
Chicago, IL.
I derive so much joy out of your anger, so for you, no appointment is needed. Just let the door man know. I'm not paying for your gas though....If you can't afford it, let me know, I meet you half way.

 
At 9:56 AM , Anonymous Leo who will fuk jester master up soon said...

to jester-the chinese penis twister-master, i used to live in chicago, and i know exactly where it is..but for a small time employee like yourself who clocks out right on the dot, i highly doubt you can afford living there...so leave a unit number, or better yet...a real address, would be much less of cowardice of you. by the by, i've learned my thuggish threat from the chinese commies who are pointing missiles at us as we speak, so you should be thanking them instead. I’ll take your word for it, but if you ever browse this website again, then you are the chinese ding dong sucking bitch, okay? And if you ever comment again on this website, your name would not be jester the cock master, it would be Chinese ding dong sucker whore, ok? alrite, hurry up now, u don’t wanna miss your CTA train.

 
At 9:58 AM , Anonymous Anonymous said...

To Jester master and Leo,
You two can go give each other the reach-around in your own gay blog...Let's talk politics on this one!

 
At 10:02 AM , Anonymous Jester master said...

"by the by?" Where did you learn your EngRish from? fob...

 
At 10:08 AM , Anonymous Leo who will fuk jester master up soon said...

to jester the lying master aka the chinese ding dong sucker whore...wow, you came back and commented again! you are just like Ma, a lying bag of feces! just can't deliver on your promises, eh?! with fake address, no apartment number, no telephone, no email, and a fake "i'm done here" BS statement...only empty promises, nothing but a fake liar you are, but i suspect your last name must be Ma as well.

 
At 10:23 AM , Anonymous jester master said...

OK, Leo, Eric, You're right. I'm wrong. President Ma sucks cock and I don't have a job. China is nothing but a huge communist duschebag. Taiwan is an independent and sovereign nation. I'm a big lier and a big clown. I'm sorry. I'm gonna take my lunch box and take the CTA home now. Enjoy your night/day.

 
At 10:25 AM , Anonymous jester master said...

And that was my last comment. Wish you all the best.

 
At 10:41 AM , Anonymous Anonymous said...

To jester master

You must be a pathetic nerd that has no life but computer. So this is what your whole life about - talk sh*t about other people. Perhaps you should try to get a real job and maybe get out of your room once a while. You might actually see the real world. Actually, you probably could start by going to your cousin's party since it's only gonna be you and him/her only.

 
At 10:45 AM , Anonymous Leo who will fuk jester master up soon said...

bullies don't like to get bullied, especially cyberbullies... whatever, you know you'll come back...b/c "if things that you say can be trusted, feces can be eaten." evidently someone said "i am done here" over an hour but still making comments...shall see you again.

 
At 1:00 PM , Blogger Eric said...

leo, don't let the master molester get to you. all he keeps saying is that he has a lot of money and that he's smarter than all of us, but the greatest part is that he can in no way back it up. by looking at every post he's made we can see that his intelligence, is, will say questionable if not totally lacking.

i mean, he said it himself that he knows shit. and i think we can all agree on this point now.

but don't get too angry because that's all they have is personal attacks. we can easily beat them using just the facts. let them say the lame, hateful comments. personally, i find them hilarious to read.

 
At 1:06 PM , Blogger Formosan at Heart said...

This comment has been removed by the author.

 
At 1:08 PM , Blogger Formosan at Heart said...

Stuff Mainlanders Like made a lot of valid points along with many others. As a hardcore Taidu ABT, I recognize my preference for democracy, which brings considerable baggage like a wavering economy and visible corruption. Emphasis on the word visual.

At the same time, taking away rights that Taiwanese have had like free speech becomes seriously problematic. Especially by a corrupt government. It would be different if it were Japan in 1895, who exerted significant power and control, but were mostly fair. Mostly.

Moving on, what's Taiwan? A free country. Yet China continues to encroach on our sovereignty. In years past we were able to ward it off because our economy was so much better. Now, more countries are breaking ties with us to form ties with China. Of course, the UN will do nothing, despite the continuous threat to Taiwan. So from my perspective, Taiwan stands at the crossroad. Continue to fight, meaning bolstering its economy so that nations would have incentive to hold onto ties with Taiwan. OR, give into China. Sadly, Taiwan's unstable identity has resulted in brain drain for Taiwan. Eric, I think it's great that you are back in Taiwan. Some appreciate it, some don't. Keep up the work but allow new ideas to inform your Taidu framework.

One last point. How important is the sovereignty of Taiwan? I believe it is a matter of the utmost importance. Yet, we should keep in mind that every moment we spend on "I HATE MA" "CHINA TAINTED OUR MILK" we lose the opportunity to talk about the educational disparity and inequality in Taiwan among many other crucial issues. If we lose our sovereignty, we may also lose our ability to discuss these issues. However, is it possible that we can become a better place if we take away the burdens of running a nation and constantly fighting for our sovereignty? Now that the election has passed, it will be another four years. IF, Taiwan has already lost its sovereignty by then, how will we respond? Will this further perpetuate the brain drain? I believe so. Yet, I also think that we Taiwanese have demonstrated amazing resilience and we can make the best of situations. So keep an open mind, prepare for the worst, hope for the best... Keep the Taiwan pride. Naruwan!

 
At 2:22 PM , Anonymous Takumi Chen said...

After reading all the stupid ass comments from Jester, all I have to say is...shut the fuck up!

 
At 6:15 PM , Anonymous jianjian said...

你能站出來,說明你是個有血性的漢子,但很遺憾你做錯了,很遺憾你生在美國,你沒有經歷和感受過中華民族曾經的苦痛,所以你不知道民族強大對我們中華民族有什麼樣的意義。你可能也沒有聽說過鄧小平和一國兩制。相信你是追求真理的人,多去瞭解一些歷史,你會懂這一切是為什麼。

 
At 7:44 PM , Blogger Eric said...

jianjian,

growing up as a taiwanese-american in the states you get all kinds of discrimination from chinese people. something that many people on taiwan have never experienced. the hate that they exude is unbearable as a taiwanese, no matter where you were born. have you experienced being hated on like this before?

just because i wasn't born here, don't make the assumption that i don't know my taiwanese history. you'd be surprised. i had the luck of not being brainwashed by the KMT growing up.

and we're citizens of taiwan, not the ROC. i dare you to go to anyone outside of Taiwan and tell them you're from the ROC. everyone will think you're from china, until you finally clarify by saying taiwan. the name ROC only exists in taiwan. i challenge you to look outside at the rest of the world, not just taiwan and china. i think if you do that, you might have a better idea of where i'm coming from. you don't have to be born here to fight for this country.

 
At 9:53 PM , Anonymous Anonymous said...

Eric,
your comment to jianjian...I totally agree with ya~ I've been there and experienced that whole situation when I was growing up in the states.

-Sana

 
At 10:00 PM , Anonymous Anonymous said...

Oh yeah~ I am truly glad that I had the luck of not being brainwashed by the nasty KMT growing up. ^__^

-Sana

 
At 10:36 PM , Blogger Stuff Mainlanders Like said...

wait...what's wrong with believing taiwan=roc?

i know it is probably just wishful thinking...but like i said before eric, what you just said was not very inclusive of all people in taiwan.

roc does not equate to the kmt anymore. we need to move on from that and try to promote democracy. it is great that we can disagree without arbitrary arrest, don't you think?

i understand ROC is occupying taiwan illegally according to international law, but i also think the US will not take over taiwan's sovereignty.

(and yes, i want to say that mainlanders like to fuck with us in the states. when i was the VP of TSA @ UGA, they would come protest during our events)

 
At 11:31 PM , Blogger Eric said...

if you want to believe in the ROC, then go right ahead. i'm just saying that in the real world outside of taiwan, the ROC is a meaningless name. every person that starts out saying ROC has to clarify in the end by saying Taiwan. this is a reality. to keep telling taiwanese people that the ROC still exists is a waste of time. and the ROC is linked with the KMT.

and i don't claim to represent everyone in taiwan, and i never will. but just as i don't represent everyone, neither does your view that the Taiwan = ROC. that's the beauty of a democratic society. i can speak out for what i believe in.

and are you sure we can disagree without arbitrary arrest? look at all the abuse that's going on in taipei. all just to stop taiwanese people from speaking. that i cannot agree with for a second. we are not china and taiwanese will not stand for this type of abuse from our own government just in order to protect some communist from seeing the truth.

 
At 1:05 AM , Anonymous Anonymous said...

Are you happy now that there is a riot going on in Taipei? DPP politicians are so predictable. They never fail to take any chance to put up violent show using stupid Taiwanese.

Of course the Communists know what these DPP are proresting before they even set foot in Taiwan. Do you think the Communists like all those DPP politicians visiting China? Communists are much smarter than the DPP politicians, because Communists have long term strategy as to how they will take back Taiwan while these DPP politicians have been just aiming for short term political gains and the next election.

I have been thoroughly disappointed by DPP as of tonight.

 
At 2:17 AM , Blogger Eric said...

maybe if the police weren't beating on innocent taiwanese people there wouldn't be a need for this. and who's to blame for the police? ma ying jeou.

i see a lot more taiwanese people standing up than just DPP politicians. all the people that have been injured by the police these past few days have been regular taiwanese people that have had the guts to stand up and be heard.

get out from behind your computer and scream your support communist china here in taiwan and see what the reaction is. if you really believe in it, let us hear you.

 
At 2:59 AM , Anonymous Anonymous said...

Yes, ROC is a stupid and meaningless name indeed.

And who care about what 鄧小平和一國兩制 said!

Taiwan is Taiwan, Taiwan has nerver been part of China!!

What happened recently makes me sad, but it will not defeat my hope. In fact, it strengthens me.
Viva!! Taiwan.


Chun

 
At 3:38 AM , Anonymous Dr. of Phsychology and History in CA said...

Everyone, you got to read the book that KMT ban in TW called "Black Heart and Blood Philosophy" in mandarin. This is written by chinese who document and theorize that in order to control chinese, one has to be ruthless, and "black hearted." Because fear is only thing that control them. Not democracy, not reasoning.

Basically, when dealing with chinese or chinese sympathizer, be tough, be rough, and don't give them an inch. Many Taiwanese were too naive that is why Ma is in power now, and many regret it now.
But its not too late...we have the backing of the US government weather you believe it or not. A revolution might be needed if this thing spirals out and KMT turn into Commies.

Dr. Phsych

 
At 4:32 AM , Anonymous Anonymous said...

"maybe if the police weren't beating on innocent taiwanese people there wouldn't be a need for this."

Wait a minute- are these people sitting home and the police look them up and beat them up in their homes? Don't pretend that these are peaceful demonstrators being roughed up by police. The DPP politicians called their supporters to be there and they are out looking for trouble so that they can get on TV. U.S. and all the other democratic countries would take the same security measure to break up a rioting crowd. Don't act like these kinds of mob-rule behaviors are tolerated in other democratic countries.

DPP politicians only preach and exerice the "rights" in a democracy, but forget the "responsibilies" and "restraint"s that are also needed for a matrue and stable democracy to flourish. DPP has now positioned themselves as the 30% political party with support by people like you, and that is the sadded thing for Taiwan's democracy.

 
At 9:08 AM , Anonymous Anonymous said...

"growing up as a taiwanese-american in the states you get all kinds of discrimination from chinese people. "

Gorwing up in america, you sure get way more discrmination from white Americans. You probably get asked very often "where are you from" as if you are not Americans. Does that make you hate the Americans as much as you hate the "Chinese"? I am not sure how many Mainland Chinese you have met in the U.S., but you are just exggaerating how you were "treated" by the "Chinese" in America.

 
At 10:20 AM , Anonymous Ilovetaiwan said...

When this 陳雲林 guy lay his foot on Taiwan's land, Ma's and KMT's real face is shown. This week is going to be the darkest days of
Taiwan's democracy.

Screw you Communist! screw you 陳雲林!!
Taiwan and China
are different countries!!

陳雲林 OUT!!
Ma Ying Jeou DOWN!!!

 
At 11:59 AM , Blogger Eric said...

does america have 1800+ ballistic missiles pointed at taiwan? does american deny taiwan entry into the UN or WHO? does america claim that taiwan is a part of the US? does america have a worldwide propaganda campaign to force the world into thinking that taiwan is a part of the US?

i mean, they just voted a black man president of the US, Obama 08! you're putting words in my mouth. since when did i say i hate americans? sure i experienced racism growing up in the states. however, if you think that chinese people around the world don't bully taiwanese, then you really are blind and totally disconnected from what we call reality. i am a proud taiwanese-american, and do not refer to myself in anyway whatsoever as chinese.

don't tell me what you think it was like for me growing up because you obviously have no idea.

next.

 
At 12:53 PM , Anonymous Anonymous said...

起來!不願做奴隸的人們!
把我們的血肉,築成我們新的長城!
中華民族到了最危險的時候,
每個人被迫着發出最後的吼聲。
起來!起來!起來!
我們萬眾一心,
冒着敵人的炮火,前進!
冒着敵人的炮火,前進!
前進!前進!進!

 
At 1:38 PM , Blogger e*star said...

Thank you, Eric, for keeping us in the know - and for all you do!!

 
At 1:43 PM , Anonymous Buddhawind said...

DPP was given a chance to change what the KMT did in 2000 for Taiwan. Eight years later we haven’t seen any improvement but corruption. President Ma, as he should be properly addressed, had all of 6 months to do what? He’s doing a clean up job and a new direction for past mistakes. Most people say the KMT is corrupt because of money laundering, what of the former president Chen? The money laundering is somehow better than the old KMT? Why also knock the KMT? Did they not bring about Taiwan's rise? Did they not allow a system whereby DPP had the chance to come into power? Now I see the DPP incite violence to the people, how humane is that? Their protest is violent not peaceful. Pretence of being civil wasn’t very peaceful.

Being an expat of Taiwan there are many non-asian that cannot distinguish the difference between South Asians period. Can you? The majority of Chinese mainlanders may be uncouth but what of the actions of the DPP and the way the protests are conducted? I don’t see a difference in the way of civilized between the DPP and the Communist party. Don't be so ignorant and claim to be so reasonable. Native Taiwanese people? They're the real Taiwanese. All others are descendents of China. Taiwan and China is one nation with two political system. We merge or we don't. There was a recent referendum was voted down, why can't DPP accept that? Lobby the Government and oppose the Government like a civilized party. Stop inciting the people to cause more heartache for the Taiwanese people. With the way things are going I see civil war in the horizon. Brain-washing is when the end is for the wrong purpose like the Nazis, Genocide? Duh. Distinguish what you're fighting for your heritage or a nation? Taiwan, ROC is part of the world and it has its obstacles, the Government needs to direct the Country to survive and to prosper. How do you propose to achieve that? The United States? Must we always rely and refer to the United States?

 
At 2:04 PM , Blogger Formosan at Heart said...

Speaking of which, where can I buy the shirts that the protesters wear? I SO want one.

 
At 2:19 PM , Anonymous Hating China With Great Passion said...

Ma has lied again today...not a surprise, like he does it every freaking day anyway...but you gotta admit, it was a well thought out one that caught dpp by surprise, what a two-face liar ma is...

 
At 2:44 PM , Anonymous Anonymous said...

如果今天山地人說他們要獨立建個台灣國,看這些台獨會不會支持山地人? 山地人才是
真的台灣人,你們這些"閩南豬"為什們不滾回大陸啊? 你們"閩南豬"是乞丐趕廟公.

If the REAL Taiwanese, the Aborigines, want to establish our own country, will people like Eric support us? You, Fuklo pigs should go back to where you came from which is China- that's right, Eric- you are Chinese, not Taiwanese- not even close.

 
At 3:01 PM , Anonymous Anonymous said...

當初美國 是很多英國籍.非洲籍到美國去的 在今天 美國人會說他自己是英國人或非洲人嗎 大陸人對我們那麼不好 砲口對準我們 不稱馬小狗為總統 當初投馬小狗一票的都傻了阿 你們當初是選總統嗎 還是選戶長阿
不要被賣了還在幫別人算錢 傻傻的嘛

 
At 3:15 PM , Anonymous Anonymous said...

Sounds like Eric doesn't want a democratic and peaceful Taiwan. He endorses and loves a country ruled by '民禁黨' mobs. Perahps he should move to Congo or Somolia. Sounds like his kind of country.

 
At 3:46 PM , Blogger 正港台灣人 said...

昨天那個鏡頭看起來.....
陳雲林反而不像「共匪」,倒是民進黨比較像「土匪」
哎 現在國民黨是「爛黨」可是民進黨又變成「亂黨」
民主運動三十年結果現在台灣雙輸 反而中國大陸贏了 被人家「看破手腳」了 看到台灣公權力的不張和現在暴民可在台灣亂政的真相

為民主奮鬥三十年 到現在竟還有沒有民主的素養政客及不尊重法律公民 真是浪費了

 
At 3:47 PM , Anonymous Anonymous said...

用熊貓就想換得台灣人的心 怎麼可能
那我可以用兩隻台灣黑熊 換一些大陸妹嗎
放在籠子大家輪流 看

 
At 4:04 PM , Blogger Eric said...

if aboriginals want their own country, i'm totally in support of it, 100%. what the aboriginals have gone through on this island is horrible and should not have to happen to anyone.

i never said i represented the first and only taiwanese. i never will. everyone that lives on this island now that wants to consider themselves taiwansese is taiwanese. that's what i'm saying.

 
At 4:07 PM , Blogger Eric said...

buddhawind, must we always refer to the US?

answer me this, why must we always refer to China?

 
At 4:42 PM , Anonymous buddhawind said...

Eric,

Let me clarify, we're always referring to US to help us out. Why don't we refer to China? Why not? Tons of Taiwanese businessmen are capitalizing on the oppurtunity because of the closeness to culture actually we're from that culture. The late great Wong Yong Ching could have been the richest man if the Government hadn’t stopped him. If we let bygones be bygones we can move on. What you think the Chinese will turn back to Commies? Not likely, they've had a taste of limited democracy, and freedom. Cultural Revolution Number two? Not bloody likely. At this rate we’re more likely to head into a cultural revolution than them. They had it and they didn’t like it, we had similarities early on I don’t think anyone welcomes that.

I've learned as a kid to be afraid of the Chinese... how bad they are and what not, that's back then and that's ignorant. There's ignorant Taiwanese as well, as according to my great debater friend (who argues with me from the DPP, totally agree should have given DPP the chance in 2000) most people are misinformed. Back then they were poor, not so now, they're the largest economy in Asia. Why not?
The People of Taiwan is important as is the future of its people, the Government as a whole does the best it can. We can see good and bad from around the world. The Chinese have learned to take the good from the bad. We in our heritage were taught to do the same but we didn't did we? Let's look forward to do what's best. We've lost the upper-hand a long time ago, when China needed our help joining the world. They've done a fine job themselves, now they look forward to joining up period. If we're not up to it we can cooperate and join later under favourable condition that is suitable to the people both sides of the strait.
If the people want to compare themselves to Americans or other nations with similarities well look at what it took for them to get it. War. You all want that? 'cause with the US busy with two wars already and lots of hostiles around the world you think they'll have time to come save us? Well no thanks let's save ourselves. You think we can win a full-out war with China? Don't even try it it's not fair to put Taiwan to war because the minority of Taiwanese can't control their tempers.

 
At 5:10 PM , Blogger 正港台灣人 said...

buddhawind 英文太好了, 也說到我的心坎裡了!
今天民進黨在那喊打喊殺 是很「爽」, 像個三歲小孩發了頓脾氣, 政客也鞏固了基本盤, 可是整個台灣付的代價太高了, 「錢途」都為民進黨政客陪葬了.:( 如果我是有意在台灣設總部的外商, 看到這樣的反對黨, 一定是「皮皮挫」 ,連考慮都不會考慮. 最後倒霉的跑不掉的台灣下一代, 不是每個人都像Eric 這麼好命,有美國護照隨時可以「落跑」, 家裡有錢, 不愁錢的人當然可以把台獨建國當飯吃. This is really not a good day for Taiwan or Taiwan's democracy.
------------------------
buddhawind可以幫我寫的翻譯成英文嗎?
buddhawind- can you please translate my above thoughts to English for me?

 
At 5:26 PM , Anonymous Anonymous said...

正港台灣人 I would love to. Unfortunately I can't read Chinese so well. I left Taiwan a long time ago.

I only care because of love for Taiwan. I thought Taiwan was huge! Then my brother pointed out how big the world is as compared to Taiwan, not to say my love diminished but to say this is the truth. Still have tons of relatives and friends I love. They're die hard Taiwanese, as am I, that's why I'm writing here (don't know where else to write) for the first time online. Feel free to copy and paste what I write.

 
At 5:30 PM , Blogger 正港台灣人 said...

還有, 反正三通是定了, 我建議Eric及所有在這嗆大陸中共的ABT及台灣人去大陸走走.. 看看人家的建設及現況,不要在台灣當井底之蛙憑空想像共產黨這樣那樣的 以為大陸還是文革 天安門時代的大陸

去大陸走走看看, 起碼知己知彼 百戰百勝嘛.

buddhawind- if you don't mind, please translate this for me for the ABTs to read.

 
At 5:37 PM , Anonymous Anonymous said...

Most Taiwanese are peaceful, logical and reasonable

絕大部份的台灣人都是愛好和平,理性且講道理的

What DDP (the minority party in Taiwan) does today cannot stand for all Taiwanese.

民進黨今天所做的事並不能代表所有台灣人

 
At 5:39 PM , Anonymous Anonymous said...

Eric, keep up the spirits!
and do not mind those pointless blabbers who are just looking for quarrels on your blog!

 
At 7:18 PM , Blogger Eric said...

buddhawind,

just because taiwan does business with china, it doesn't meed we need to become part of china. japan and korea do a lot of business in china, do they need to become part of china? the whole world does a lot of business with china, does the whole world need to become a part of china?

can taiwan win in a war against china? hell no. but will that stop people in taiwan from speaking out for justice and what they think is right? no.

and get this straight, communist china hasn't gotten even a taste of democracy. what democratic rights do they respect in China? please elaborate.

what they have gotten a taste for is CAPITALISM, not democracy. the two are totally different. they have monetary freedom now, which is totally different from having freedom of speech and right to protest.

and also, if you're going to say that we're all originally from china, why stop at china? where did people come from before china? huh? using your argument, we're all from africa cuz that's where the first humans originated from. right? or are you just going back as long as it helps your argument.

 
At 9:23 PM , Anonymous Buddhawind said...

Eric,

See this is the problem with playing devil’s advocate, you keep on arguing the opposite and for what? You asked me a question about why refer to US and why must we refer to China. Well for your answer are you suggesting why not? If so then you’ve answered your own question haven’t you? Why have you changed the question to being whether we should be part of China or not? If you wanted an answer to a rhetorical question don’t bother asking. I mean with your last point of Africa and what not, why are you accusing whether it helps my argument? You’ve basically made it your argument and asking whether I agree or not. If that’s the case I think it would be great if the whole world is all one group, humans. But that’s off track don’t you agree?

Oh so you’re sure that Taiwan can’t win a war against China and it doesn’t stop people in Taiwan from speaking out for justice and what they think is right? Why ask a question if you’re going to answer yourself? What justice are you searching for, if you feel so strongly why don’t you go to China and express your opinion? Tons of people protested during the Olympics were you there?
Taste of Capitalism is a taste of democracy, it’s a part of it. As you’ve said monetary freedom, in a Communist society there is currency control. Isn’t that a taste? If you have understood properly Democracy you will know freedom of speech is NOT the only form of a Democracy.

Really honestly now it doesn’t sadden you to see the state of Taiwan now? During KMT protests of the former president Chen was their protests to this scale? Those protests are an example of what it means to have a peaceful protest. You agree with DPP inciting revolt? You want to take down Chen Yuen Lin? Well if you think you’re in a war with China or want a war, why not go to China you’d have won half the battle to get there. But please don’t say you represent all of Taiwan or all Taiwanese because there’s many Taiwanese that don’t think the way you do and you bring danger to them.

Would you like to move towards solutions or would you want to keep arguing a pointless argument I’m right and you’re wrong kind of thing? That doesn’t accomplish anything or the Chaos that is in Taiwan.

Btw Chen isn't a government official... you just react this to a China resident... there's no Chinese that reacts this way to the hundred of thousands of Taiwanese in China.

 
At 1:43 AM , Blogger Eric said...

you thought the red shirt movement was a real people's demonstration? wow.

 
At 1:45 AM , Blogger Eric said...

why would i go to china to protest? i'm not chinese. i have no desire to go there whatsoever, let alone protest there. maybe you can go and warm things up a bit.

 
At 2:58 AM , Anonymous don bear said...

這幾天對政府的感覺就是...
麻木不仁 苟且偷生 好傻 好天真
唉~~不要好好的人不做 要做馬英九啦

 
At 5:47 AM , Anonymous Anonymous said...

起來!不願做奴隸的人們!
把我們的血肉,築成我們新的長城!
中華民族到了最危險的時候,
每個人被迫着發出最後的吼聲。
起來!起來!起來!
我們萬眾一心,
冒着敵人的炮火,前進!
冒着敵人的炮火,前進!
前進!前進!進!

 
At 6:46 AM , Anonymous Hating China With Great Passion! said...

The sellout, minute-man Ma has revealed his real face today, by pounding on the podium, he’s mad at us Taiwanese cuz his Chinese boss did not have enough of sleep last night, so Ma could only have a few loving minutes of ass kissing with his Chinaman, all in all, the meeting was a joke made up by two clowns.

Sure, business and economy are important, but they aren’t everything, not every one would sell their souls to the Chinese devil, not every would sell their dignity and pride for a few dollars, not even clsoe, even any country and its citizens in this world know that…I dare you to ask the Argentineans and see if they would sell their country and sovereignty to any other countries just so they could bail out their own economic crisis at home. There are things that are more sacred and cannot be traded. Businessmen like Buddha’s rear wind, saying business comes first and shall put everything aside that is the same as being a prostitute, willing to sell your own body just for a few quick bucks, but at least being a prostitute is better than being a businessman doing business in china, at least they know what “moral and shame” mean. If doing business in china is so great, then move to china, become a Chinese citizen, don’t ever step a foot on Taiwan…you just can’t eat the cake and take it too, you shortsighted pigs. By the way, don’t tell us to go to china, and personally, I don’t care if they are doing so well and so modernized, I don’t live there, and I am not Chinese, so I could careless of China and how well it is doing. Brazil, India, and Russia are doing well, so why don’t you go there? Furthermore, according to your reasoning, if we did more business with brazil, India, or Russia, then we should be a part of their country and become their citizens? Also, the EU trades with a lot of countries that aren’t in Europe, does that mean their major trading partners should become a member of EU? Freaking nonsense logics of yours… Last, if you have been living outside of Taiwan for a long period of time, you should definitely visit Taiwan and see how it really is now, stop living abroad and imagining of Taiwan as how it was before.

 
At 8:03 AM , Anonymous Why all these personal attack? said...

These relentless personal attacks and totally off-topic coments made by Chinese like jester master perfectly sum up what's going on between Taiwan and China.

I'm sure jester master knows that personal attacks does nothing but discrediting himself in a debate, but he just couldn't help but keep doing it.

Just look at Pomfret's column on WashingtonPost.com and you'll see the same pattern--
Everytime Mr. Pomfret writes something that his Chinese readers don't like, they resort to personal attacks and totally side-tracked arguments instead of logically sound arguments. Hunderds of them! Needless to say, this only annoys everyone else who happens to end up on Pomfret's column.

Of course those Chinese who know enough English to leave a comment on Pomfret's column know they are convincing nobody by making personal attacks. But they just can't help doing it.

I started to believe that it's Chinese culture to attack others when they don't agree with them.

 
At 8:29 AM , Anonymous Anonymous said...

圍城失控 藍營批蔡英文:沒那個屁股、不要吃那個瀉藥


台北街頭上演嚴重的流血衝突,藍營立委痛批民進黨主席蔡英文,已經變成「暴力小英」,認為她沒有群眾運動的經驗,就不應該動員人民上街頭。藍營強調,蔡英文必須為流血衝突,負最大責任。

大陸海協會會長陳雲林訪台後,這幾天從圓山飯店、國賓飯店以及晶華酒店,警民火爆對峙衝突一波接著一波,而今天馬陳會無預警提前至上午11時舉行,圍城民眾缺了抗議主角馬英九與陳雲林,仍然選擇繼續遊行嗆聲,情緒高漲場面數度失控,造成警察、記者以及民眾數十人相繼掛彩。

對此,藍營點名蔡英文必須負起最大的責任。國民黨立委張碩文痛斥蔡英文「沒有那個屁股,就不要吃那個瀉藥」,把無辜惜情的善良老百姓煽動上街後,居然把他們就這樣放在台北街頭。

立委費鴻泰指出,蔡英文以往給人的感覺蠻理性的,但這次所做的點點滴滴,讓人看到她內心其實是個充滿暴力、喜歡血腥的女子,現在她多了一個外號,就叫做「暴力的小英」。而立委謝國樑也直接點名,台北市已經亂了,而這個亂源就是蔡英文。

 
At 11:13 AM , Anonymous buddhawind said...

You know Eric the red shirt movement was a proper demonstration as it was peaceful. Or do you think a mob mentality type of demonstration is necessary to consider a demonstration "Real"?

You don't want to go to China to protest, you want to do it in the safety of your own house. So it's right to incite riots, trying to instill hatred in the people to be against China at the risk of War? You think all Chinese should stay in China and all Taiwanese should stay in Taiwan. Americans should stay in America. Everybody should stay home right?

 
At 11:39 AM , Blogger Eric said...

the red shirt movement was not orchestrated by the people, it was a show put on by the KMT, plain and simple. i was here in taiwan and went to many of their lame demonstrations. did the A-bian send out 10,000 police and put barbwire all over taipei? did the government at the time deny the right of the "protestors" to wave the ROC flag or to shout out "dao bian" or whatever other ridiculous chants they wanted to shout? no.

however that's what happened in taipei this past week. or did you not notice the police deny the right to free speech and protest?

how was the red shirt movement peaeceful? they camped in front of the presidential office for weeks. they clogged up taipei main station as well. the blue leaning media of course made it seem like a huge people's movement which it was not.

i don't protest in china because i'm not chinese. yes, and you're right, i believe americans should stay in american, that's why i'm part american and living in taiwan right now. that's why i have plenty of american friends here that i support and are more taiwanese than you are.

if chinese support taiwan's choice to self-determination, than i welcome them to taiwan. i support anyone that respects our right to sovereignty.

who exactly am i instilling hatred in? a coward like you. don't watch if you don't like the channel.

 
At 12:10 PM , Anonymous Anonymous said...

這幾天終魚證實KMT從1945就在騙,反攻大陸救解同胞殺共匪都是放屁,現在只會在台灣等支那人幫陳雲林吹喇叭...KMT-沒那個屁股、不要吃那個瀉藥!

 
At 12:38 PM , Anonymous Anonymous said...

Anonymous 12:10 PM
你是山地人嗎? 不是山地人你就是支那人的野種喔 說你只配當野種因為你自己祖宗十八代都不認了

 
At 12:56 PM , Anonymous Buddhawind said...

Eric,

So you’re saying the DPP didn’t orchestrate this protest?

In the redshirt movement was there a foreign visitor that got knocked down and punched? Was there aggression? The police went from plain uniform to riot gear for what? Or was it because they actively searched out protestors to beat on them?

You’re also speaking on two sides. You say President Chen allowed the people to speak their mind protest etc. Then on the same token you say this isn’t one. Which is it? Do you know what peaceful means? They caused delays and obstacles to Taipei. This isn’t peaceful? It’s aggressive? It’s violent? Wow then where was your blog about this terror? There were 300k people. That’s not a huge people’s movement?
By the way, let’s be clear I was asking you if it’s right, don’t say yes I’m right because I don’t agree with you on that point. How you can say yes I think Americans should stay in America and then say you’re part American staying in Taiwan. Should there be a part of you that stays in America? Is that physically possible? So your American friends in Taiwan should be in Taiwan? Shouldn’t they go back to the States by your logic?

How do you become more Taiwanese than the next guy? I’m asking you not to instil hatred period. Plus you do want to instil hate? Not working dude, grow up. Flip the Channel? Is that how you take care of things?

 
At 1:09 PM , Anonymous Anonymous said...

起來!不願做奴隸的人們!
把我們的血肉,築成我們新的長城!
中華民族到了最危險的時候,
每個人被迫着發出最後的吼聲。
起來!起來!起來!
我們萬眾一心,
冒着敵人的炮火,前進!
冒着敵人的炮火,前進!
前進!前進!進!

 
At 1:30 PM , Anonymous Anonymous said...

叫原著民山地人?!你們支那人也太精神錯亂自我為是了,也間接的證明你不住臺或離臺太久,台灣稱呼他們為原著民很久了 對對對,您爸是野種,有原著民,日本.支那血統,但做野種也比純支那人好,等您爸出草殺光你們人在台心在支那的支那人!好膽別走!

 
At 2:52 PM , Anonymous Anonymous said...

http://takayukiroom.blogspot.com/2007/12/blog-post_29.html

if you are gonna post links, post something educational, this one tells the 228 massacre. KMTs = liars, murderers, china lovers.

 
At 3:00 PM , Blogger Eric said...

buddhawind, learn what sarcasm is, then read what i wrote again. you put words in my mouth, and i basically took it to the extreme.

i'm not going to waste my time explaining how the red shirt movement was fake to someone that believes that it was a peaceful people's protest. i'd be wasting my time writing. just like you have wasted all this time leaving comments on my blog.

i personally don't think i'm instilling hate. if you think i am, tell people.

do i turn off garbage when i see it? of course. i mean, i've only had to read like 10 percent of what you wrote to realize that i don't need to read the rest.

 
At 3:33 PM , Anonymous buddhawind said...

Ok so we’ve established that you’re being sarcastic period. Why would you be so passionate politically if you just want to be sarcastic? How do you expect people to react on such a serious topic? I believe I haven’t put anything in your mouth, as you say it’s an opinion and I’m expressing mine. So you like taking things to extreme, you want extremities to occur in Taiwan like terrorists? I don’t think that’s the way. You don’t want to waste time explaining how the red shirt movement was fake and that I believe it was a good example of peaceful demonstration then what can you do other than knock other people and Government bodies to be a rebellious? I would think someone that claims such loyalty and passion with seemingly intelligence can to better to suggest a better way of doing things. So you turn off garbage when you see it. So how come you replied to many things I wrote? If you’ve read only ten percent how can you understand everything that I was saying to you? It’s like you can see 10% of a subject and make decisive conclusions. How are these informed decisions? You only understand 10% of the matter!

Could have spent our time better at what would better Taiwan. You want to overcome the Chinese (Mr. Goliath as one friend puts it) and leave you alone and have International support? Acting like a kid isn’t going to help.

 
At 3:57 PM , Anonymous don bear said...

http://tw.youtube.com/watch?v=Z2RTvpm_L-g&feature=related

神豬可以開 法拉利 陳致中就不能開 積架
國民黨連吃大便的樣子都是高尚 民進黨只想吃一碗肉燥飯就是浪費奢侈
大家回想一下小時候讀的歷史課本.....
是假的 你說是吧 國民政府執政 曾提過台灣歷史嗎 提過228對台灣人有多痛嗎? 不要再被洗腦了
說到國籍問題?誰住哪? 國民黨把台灣搞得烏煙瘴氣後
他們一些姓蔣的後代 拿著壓榨台灣人的財產 全都跑到國外享福 到了選舉才回來死老爸
完全不知道台灣在國民黨的統治下 台灣人民有多苦 苦 又不能發聲 不能有意見
如今到了現在 我們又回來了

年輕人 或許覺得政治很煩 很吵
但是 我們都住在這裡 不是嗎
講出你想講的 做你想做的 這就是台灣民主可貴的地方

年輕是應該站出來的!!!!!

 
At 4:48 PM , Anonymous Anonymous said...

"神豬可以開 法拉利 陳致中就不能開 積架
國民黨連吃大便的樣子都是高尚 民進黨只想吃一碗肉燥飯就是浪費奢侈"


啊!說到重點了! 人家國民黨及連家可沒假惺惺,假窮啊.
阿扁- 可是打著"三級貧戶"的招牌,然後說什麼 "清廉愛台灣" 大家才投給他,結果請他去
抓鬼他竟然被鬼抓了! 還青出於藍更勝於藍(阿扁還是國民黨員從未正式退黨), 阿扁他一家可是什麼錢都要吃, 還在假惺惺.

台灣竟然還有十八趴的傻百姓相信他們貪污的錢是"建國基金"!! 不過沒關係啦,台灣是民主國家, 你愛投誰就投誰, 但台灣沒獨立這筆帳,你可不要算在國民黨頭上,民進黨當家八年, 為什麼不宣佈台灣獨立??? 啊對了,阿扁一家忙著洗鈔票,才沒空理這些台獨白痴啦!! 哈哈哈... 你們還在執著於台獨的人,真是被阿扁賣了還在替他們數鈔票!

 
At 6:37 PM , Anonymous Anonymous said...

樓上的
那請問國民黨喊消滅共匪 反攻大陸五六十年了
做到了沒有
跟你說 到現在國民黨還是鬥輸共匪啦
衰到的人 是台灣人
六十年前強迫台灣人接受那面國旗
六十年後拿出來會被沒收 被打

ROC是個假招牌
而那個島確確實實就叫--台灣

中華民國的那個假主權
在陳雲林踏上台灣土地上 馬上完全消失
原來 過去的幾十年口號是喊假的

國民黨跟共產黨的恩怨關我們台灣人什麼事
卻要我們台灣子弟去當砲灰

 
At 7:12 PM , Anonymous don bear said...

說的沒錯 樓上上那位 就是標準的為了反對而反對 如果看完那段影片 認真看完留言 其實根本完全站不住腳

洗錢案根本未審先判 跟他的觀點一樣
建國基金當然沒有 因為以前國民政府就沒這筆帳 國民政府要錢 去搶.ㄠ 就有了
幹嘛甚麼屁基金阿

馬政府上任後開始一連串的政治迫害 只要約談就直接關 所以阿扁 我看應該也難逃 如果真的被關了 國民黨還搞得出新把戲嗎?
慢慢審啦
國民政府根本不管人民死活
我說要 你就要給我
我說甚麼 就是甚麼

明明就知道陳雲林來 台灣人民會有很大的反彈 還硬要她來 人民重要 還是大陸人重要
我們自己的事不用大陸人來做決定 來了後
大家還搶著請他吃飯 喝酒 幫他吹...3個6(我是說...吹牛) 抓!
對 就是抓 抗議~抓 放歌~抓 甚麼都抓

唉~還是這幾句
麻木不仁
狗且偷生...
套一句香港人說的話真的是...好傻 好天真阿

 
At 7:14 PM , Blogger Eric said...

i take your arguments to the extreme. i'm not saying i'm an extreme person at all. that's not how i think. i take your argument of saying that many of taiwanese are just chinese, and just take it back farther to africa, just to show you that that line of reasoning doesn't work. to me, to be taiwanese includes everyone that lives on this island now that considers themselves taiwanese. and not just for elections.

let me be clear, i don't support any violence and i don't think that it's a way to solve anything. who said anything about terrorists? not me. but i don't think what happened up in taipei was all the fault of the DPP as you claim. the excessive police presence definitely had something to do with the escalation in violence.

and when i mean, turn off the garbage, i mean in asia so much stuff is just propaganda and lies. you only need to read a little bit of it or see a little bit of it to see where they are coming from. like you for instance. i understand everything that you're saying, but don't need to read it all because we believe in fundamentally different things, and i think that's obvious.

who cares how big china is? the whole rest of the world could be chinese for all i care, i will still always refer to myself as taiwanese.

 
At 8:02 PM , Anonymous buddhawind said...

Dear Eric,

Why would you take things to extreme if you’re not an extreme person? Or are you saying you think extreme but not an extremist?

Do make it clear if you would like to take the origins of mankind ok take it back to Africa. If you’re talking about politics and cultures as you were with your article/opinion then take it to just 60 years ago. Or would you like to disrespect your grandparents, great grandparents? Line of reasoning doesn’t work for you? Are you taking reason only when it works for your argument? Thoroughly think about your definition on what being a Taiwanese is.

You don’t support violence that’s great so do you support what happened to Zhang? A seemingly protest that knocked him down? Or this time in Taipei where the officer started in plain uniform, to sticks to riot gear. This is the 10% you saw you didn’t even see how it start. So I am pointing out this is a serious flaw to say it’s a martial law. Thanks for saying I’m not garbage and that propaganda in around Asia is full of lies and what not. So DPP is counted as? That’s not a reasonable thing is it?

Don’t even suggest you know my fundamentals, do you even know your own? You don’t care about the rest of the world you only care that you’re only Taiwanese. Then that’s the thing you should write about only. I am pretty sure you’re a young guy, I hope you grow up to be more reasonable. Narrow mindedness is what China was about when they closed themselves to the world. This gave Taiwanese the chance to be Chinese to the rest of the world. Don’t you know our founding father was asked to join the U.N. to be the representative of the Chinese on this planet? He refused because he said things aren’t settled at home. I am Taiwanese and as many around the world is, we all love Taiwan and consider ourselves part of Taiwan. Stop hurting us. I hope this is the last time I write on here. I hope you really consider what mix messaging you’re sending out. All the Best.

 
At 1:15 AM , Blogger Eric said...

okay, let's say i don't know your fundamentals and that you definitely don't know mine.

i can guarantee i'm not disrespecting my grandparents or great grandparents. making a little personal aren't we? i know where my family came from and because of that, i choose to speak out.

just because my blog talks about taiwan, you're taking a pretty big leap in saying i only care about taiwan. there are a lot of struggles i care about throughout the world, but that's not what i want to talk about on my personal blog.

i'm a very reasonable person. but when it comes to china, yes i may get unreasonable because of the treatment we receive from them. until china agrees to negotiate on a state-by-state basis and recognize the right to self-determination and take down all their missiles and let us join the UN and WHO, i cannot be that understanding of china.

 
At 7:30 PM , Anonymous Ross said...

Buddhawind,
I like some of your points, very well said esp. "Taste of Capitalism is a taste of democracy, it’s a part of it.".That's so true. It's just like Taiwan's history.

I am not too sure how much you really understand about Taiwan's history. If you think the democracy was in Taiwan long time ago like the states, then you are wrong. In KMT period around 30 years ago, Taiwan is under capitalism. The process of getting democracy, the right to speak out in public, the right to elect our own president, the right to watch uncut movies (China is still doing this.)..etc, it has been so tough and painful. That's why we so want to protect it, and that's also why we don't want to be part of China.

Also, we have no hatred to Chinese people. I know most of them are like us, friendly and respect us as who we are (we respect them as Chinese too). But Chinese gov is not so friendly, Chinese gov is threatening us with missiles and trying to isolate Taiwan with other countries, unfortunately, Zhang is one of them (Yes, he is an official member of Chinese gov).

Taiwan is like a little kid being bullied by a senior kid, no help available coz he can't have a chance to make one. That's how poor Taiwan's status is in the world right now.

About the redshirt movement, I need to back up for Eric. Buddhawind, some of the facts you said are correct, but most of them are just the surface of the story. Do you know Redshirt movement actually last for more than a month (yes, ONE MONTH!). How much trouble they brought to us, ppl in Taipei? Tonnes.. the Taipei train station is alway messy. the hospital and schools closeby needed to bear for their noise, and the funnies thing is ppl in Taipei are afraid of wearing green clothes (Green = DDP)coz we will be assaulted by them. We need to tolerate this for ONE MONTH!

Look at those uni students sitting in Freedom Square (自由廣場) now, no noise, just asking Ma Ying Jeou to listen to them. I wonder how long Ma Ying Jeou would allow them to stay there? (definitely not one month i know)

Ross

 
At 10:50 PM , Anonymous buddhawind said...

Ross

I came for lack of a better forum to speak on. I tried reasoning with Eric because he was the blogger of this site. I come back for you Ross.

I hope you would start your own blog and let me know where to go because I don't know where to go. As the way you speak I can totally converse with that and let's move forward for Taiwan. As all that I've written was from concern for Taiwan I'll tell you now. I was born in Taiwan and see myself as Taiwanese but the honest truth is I am now a Canadian citizen.

I've always defended for Taiwan as people were ignorant of Taiwan. Of course my defence because of personal ignorance i.e. I didn't know Taiwan was done purely because I feel I'm Taiwanese in heart. Politics isn't really an emotional thing and it's not a feeling thing.

Now you’re right I don’t know much of history of Taiwan other than highlights. I still don’t agree with invasion of Taiwan from Japan. But they’ve apologized let’s moved on. For KMT’s ugly history as you seem to be an expert. Explain without being biased and be neutral (let the people think for themselves) Lets have the next generation grow by learning themselves. Trust me I was hot tempered and passionate but is now taught to speak and think with reason….. I’m not perfect I will explode soon or later.
With that being declared you can’t stop and preserve a section of democracy for a certain purpose. It should be welcome completely and if you can’t then that’s double standards and you can’t progress from that platform because it’s hypocritical. Not to imply many things are hypocritical.
Being a Taiwanese born, grew up in Canada and working in China I’ll say yes MANY MANY MANY Chinese sees Taiwanese as their brother and sister. The majority being idiots and morons. Yes I agree Chinese politicians are screwed in their method but they present themselves as poised, intellectual and classy. This was the way Taiwanese were. I saw this poise was lost when the fights in parliament and disorderly conduct in Taiwan. However class and poise are and again shown through President Ma. The removal of Taiwan is wrong period. That’s not characteristic of a good leader but under the current pressures facing something that’s never seen in the world he’s doing amazing. That’s what I support a government that makes mistakes yes, but in a direction for the nation.
Now consider my statement. China is wrong for thinking it can speak for Taiwan and act for Taiwan. They must recognize we run under a different system than them. In the progress of human civility we’re WAYY ahead of them percentage wise. I tell you now the Chinese politician are smart because they learn. Whether they believe what they’ve learn is yet to be seen. If the Taiwanese politiican (all parties included) are going to be idiots then they cannot compare to the Chinese. The likelihood of stupidity is higher in China than in Taiwan. When stupidity is portrayed in Taiwan make the rest of the world pre-judge the Taiwanese as ALL stupid. I don’t want that because that’s not true, it’s only allocated to a small part of Taiwanese that think they’re intelligent and reasonable.
Taiwan’s status of the “little kid” is natural because the rest of the world doesn’t understand. It doesn’t help to act like a “little kid” for your voice to be heard. As a Taiwanese and the progress we’ve made for Chinese as a whole is more than a “little kid” persona. If you want to argue about Taiwan and China let’s do it in another blog. I welcome it because I came from that mentality.
For the red shirt movement it lasted for a month you don’t hear stories of blocking ambulances of reaching hospital and you didn’t hear of “Martial law in Taiwan, déjà vu” right?

The University students sitting in Freedom Square. I use to recall that’s Chung Zhen memorial hall…… no noise… I don’t see police in riot gear. Yes President Ma (please support people’s elected voice, because DPP had Chen for 8 years before that) hasn’t responded and no police in riot gear against it. How long should President Ma allow them to stay there? Staying there’s not the problem is it? It’s for what purpose!

 
At 6:27 AM , Anonymous Anonymous said...

If you wanna support the students at the freedom square, log on to...they are broadcasting/communicating via http://live.yahoo.com/wenli

God bless those young and righteous students.
God bless our motherland - Taiwan.

 
At 6:49 AM , Anonymous Hating China With Passion Forever! said...

buddahwind,

if yourself, don't even know the history of Formosa, then how could you even understand the pain and misery we'd suffered in the past? and if one doesn't understand its past, how could one teach its own future generation, and how could the future generations even start to think when there's nothing for them to study or even to comprehend? so letting them to think themselves ain't gonna fly...we all know there are many chinese people who think our country, Taiwan, is a part of theirs, because their gov't brainwashes them every day, the Chinamen were even taught and trained not to spit or speak too loud during the olympics, brainwash and propaganda are something KMT and China do the best, but you should also be aware that there are many, many, many Taiwanese that do not want unification, and its proven to be the most popular public opinion in Taiwan, even the pan-blue polls have said so. Dont use your canadian logics on Taiwan, we aren't like quebec. When foreigners visit taiwan, we issue our own tourist visa to them and they can't obtain the vist at the chinese embassies, and they buy stuff with our own currency, not RMB, where in quebec, it doesn't issue its own visa nor currency, b/c it is a part of canada. Ha, i do feel bad for the people in quebec though, seems like its worse than us, at least we have our own sovereignty.

 
At 7:21 AM , Anonymous Anonymous said...

http://action1106.blogspot.com/

Please support the students who are protesting at the Freedom Plaza.

 
At 4:43 PM , Anonymous Anonymous said...

to 4:48

你說:神豬可以開 法拉利 陳致中就不能開 積架.....啊!說到重點了! 人家國民黨及連家可沒假惺惺,假窮啊.
.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.
閣下這句有失理性了,在一個法治國家裡,如果人人像國民黨及連家這般大大方方的操控國家資源犯法貪污,卻絲毫不掛心輿論牽制,則足以見其匪性已不只是露出冰山之一角了!然閣下卻-貶扁之巧取;褒連之豪奪-豈不是混亂社會價值觀嗎?我相信你應該不會教導你的小孩小時候不可以偷東西,但長大後可以去搶劫吧?

 
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